Header Only - DO NOT REMOVE - Extreme Networks

Site Survey Question


I'd like to do my own site survey. I have a device that reads the db signal. However, I don't want to plug and unplug an Enterasys AP to transmit signal all over the site. Any suggestions for a transmitter for this type of scenario?

47 replies

Userlevel 4
Hello Jim, if you use an PoE midspan module as power source for the AP you could simply use a USV, so you can unplug the AP form jack with outservice interuption and then move the location or you use a special site survey battery back (search for vendor Terrawave) to power the AP. If you have an actual Enterasys AP like AP3705i or AP3715i/e (only controller-based APs) you have to prepare a static configuration of transmit power settings and enable the feature "restart service in absence of controller" in the advanced settings using the webgui of the wireless controller. If you have an old AP3630 (standalone AP) no controller is needed for initial AP setup, but its better to use the AP model you like to use in the deployment (different antennas).
Userlevel 4
Update: If my informations are right the transmit power settings for AP3700 series APs do not include the antenna gain. Be sure you don't violate the maximum transmit power settings of you local regulatory domain (FCC, ETSI etc.). Best practice is to use lower power settings and not the maximum allowed transmit power.
Thanks so much for the info! I'm searching through the Terrawave website. You wouldn't happen to have link to the specific battery pack your talking about?
Nevermind. I have a PoE injector. I'm assuming you setup the access point in the controller and then plugged it into the PoE injector afterwards?
"restart service in absence of controller" in the advanced settings using the webgui of the wireless controller. I'm in the webgui of the controller but unable to find this under the advanced tab.
Enabled "restart service in absence of controller" and it's not broadcasting the SSID as hoped.
Userlevel 4
Sounds like you also enaled the option called something like "suppress ssid". This would disable sending the ssid name in the beacon. Tomorrow I could provide you a screenshot with the right settings as example.
Userlevel 4
Hello Jim, you have to create a VNS which use a topology bridged@AP and configure the wireless service with privacy = none to create an open SSID. Per default the a ssid broadcasting is enabled. But you can check these setting in the advanced setting dialog of the wireless service:

Userlevel 2
Hi Jim and Hartmut. This is some great information you are sharing! I know we have a few other customers that have faced this challenge with conducting a site survey. Looking forward to hearing some suggestions from the rest of the group.
Userlevel 1
Hi Jim Good for you I always encourage engineers to do their own surveys it is your network after all. We do all our surveys and it pays off. For big jobs we use the Terrawave type of PoE injectors. They have a sealed lead acid battery powering a PoE injector. If you are doing a lot of surveying this is a necessity. If you are thinking of making your own, buy an 802.3af compliant PoE injector. On the AP side use an autonomous (fat) AP like the 3630/3640. I don't believe there is an explicit autonomous AP for the 3700 simply click convert to autonomous mode in access approval. I could be wrong on this as we have not migrated over to the 3700 series for our survey kit yet. Good luck on the surveying, it is an artful science.
Userlevel 4
Jon Linton wrote:

Hi Jim Good for you I always encourage engineers to do their own surveys it is your network after all. We do all our surveys and it pays off. For big jobs we use the Terrawave type of PoE injectors. They have a sealed lead acid battery powering a PoE injector. If you are doing a lot of surveying this is a necessity. If you are thinking of making your own, buy an 802.3af compliant PoE injector. On the AP side use an autonomous (fat) AP like the 3630/3640. I don't believe there is an explicit autonomous AP for the 3700 simply click convert to autonomous mode in access approval. I could be wrong on this as we have not migrated over to the 3700 series for our survey kit yet. Good luck on the surveying, it is an artful science.

Hey Jim, just tried out to convert an AP3715i, but it isn't supported (see screenshot follow-up posting).
Userlevel 4
Error message appearing if you try to convert a 3700 series AP:

Userlevel 7
hsachse wrote:

Error message appearing if you try to convert a 3700 series AP:

You cannot convert an ap to standalone mode unless the model number was standalone to start with (example 3630/40). Doug Hyde Sr Support Engineer
Userlevel 4
hsachse wrote:

Error message appearing if you try to convert a 3700 series AP:

Are there any plans bring back an autonomous AP firmware for the 3700 series? Only practical solution i know is to use the "restart service in absence of controller" feature as workaround.
I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?
Userlevel 4
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

The solution could be used for the 3610, too. Its also a thin AP / controller-based AP like the 3700 models.
Userlevel 1
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

There is a way to trick the AP3610 into being 3630. It will work for surveying but I wouldn't recommend it for production.
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

Jon,

How do you trick a 3610 into being a 3630?
Userlevel 1
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

For this you'll need a console cable and some courage Interrupt the boot sequence and type the following: setenv MODEL AP3630-NAM setenv AP_FLAG 1 setenv AP_MODE 2 saveenv saveenv boot Back in ver 3.0 there were fewer options so old habits die hard. Hartmut's solution should work as well. But sometimes you are in the field and need to adjust the power, channel, etc.
Userlevel 4
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

Hello Jon, I agree my solution is really unflexible in some situations, but its the only way to use the latest Enterasys APs. Changing some configuration parameters is now very difficult. In the past I've used the AP3630/40, but know think its time to switch to the AP3700 series for realistic post-deployment site surveys. Looks like I have to carry a V2110 installation on you survey laptop in the future 😉

Doing some reverse engineering I discovered (connected to the AP3715i with ssh) a customized Linux busybox shell, so maybe there could be hack to change the configuration parameters per command line.
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

Always up for a challenge. I'll give it a shot. Thanks, Jon!
Userlevel 1
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

good to know about the 3700's I haven't attempted to put one in the survey kit yet. I'll poke around at some point and see if there are any options. Busybox is a collection of linux commands basically. It might be possible in the same way that we used to configure 2600's for surveys. I'll post results.
Userlevel 4
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

Sounds good. My Enterasys expirence started with 3600's so I don't the know the details with the older models. Interested in your results.
Userlevel 4
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

@Jon I do have a offtopic question. I will start a conversation on twitter, please check out next time.
Userlevel 2
Jim Seaman wrote:

I have a 3610. It doesn't support it. But the AP is still great though. Since I don't have a 3630 or 3700 model. Any alternatives if you don't have any of those models?

Might I suggest you start a new topic in the community? 🙂 We do have a Chatter category specifically for other topics. Would be great to see you there!

Reply