topic Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R in ExtremeWireless (WiNG)

Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

tcheurby — Thu, 03 Sep 2020 21:13:00 GMT

Hello,

I have the impression that there are still power problems on the latest firmware version. The AP310 indicates a maximum power of 2.4 GHZ at 32 mW and 50mW at 5 Ghz for the country code fr.
Strangely if I look at an AP7522 with the same firmware version the result for the AP310 is different... an idea ?

I would like to sell AP3xx but I'm still afraid.

ap310-752888#show wireless regulatory device-type ap310i fr
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Channel Set Power(mW) Power (dBm) Placement DFS CAC(mins)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 1-13 32 15 Indoor Not Required 0
2 36-48 50 17 Indoor Not Required 0
3 52-64 50 17 Indoor Required 1
4 100-116 80 19 Indoor Required 1
5 120-128 80 19 Indoor Required 1
6 132-140 80 19 Indoor Required 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ap310-752888#show version
AP310 version 7.4.1.1-001R
Copyright (c) 2004-2019 Extreme Networks, Inc. All rights reserved.
Booted from primary

ap310-752888 uptime is 0 days, 00 hours 09 minutes
CPU is ARMv7 Processor rev 5 (v7l), No. of CPUs 4
Base ethernet MAC address is 20-9E-F7-75-28-88
System serial number is 2022Y-16161
Model number is AP310i-WR

ap310-752888#

ap310-752888#show wireless radio
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RADIO RADIO-MAC RF-MODE STATE CHANNEL POWER #CLIENT
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ap310-752888:R1 20-9E-F7-54-D5-00 2.4GHz-wlan On 11 ( smt) 12 ( 30) 0
ap310-752888:R2 20-9E-F7-54-D5-10 5GHz-wlan On 44w ( smt) 14 ( 30) 1
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total number of radios displayed: 2

-------------------

ap7522-02FE30>show wireless regulatory device-type ap310i fr
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Channel Set Power(mW) Power (dBm) Placement DFS CAC(mins)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 1-13 100 20 Indoor/Outdoor NA NA
2 36-48 200 23 Indoor Not Required 0
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ap7522-02FE30>en
ap7522-02FE30#show version
AP7522 version 7.4.1.1-001R
Copyright (c) 2004-2019 Extreme Networks, Inc. All rights reserved.
Booted from secondary

ap7522-02FE30 uptime is 0 days, 07 hours 44 minutes
CPU is ARMv7, No. of CPUs 2
Base ethernet MAC address is 74-67-F7-02-FE-30
System serial number is 15316522204621
Model number is AP-7522-67030-EU

ap7522-02FE30#

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

SamPirok — Thu, 03 Sep 2020 21:39:06 GMT

Thank you for the detailed explanation. If there are still power issues on the latest release then we’d need to file a support case with your data to show the issue is still there so we can get our engineering team to continue working on a fix. Would you be able to file a support case for this issue?

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

tcheurby — Thu, 03 Sep 2020 21:56:00 GMT

Thank you for your feedback Sam.

I think the support can easily reproduce the problem. My AP was completely blank and just came out of the box. I wanted to use it as a probe for WIFI surveys.

Regards,

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

tcheurby — Wed, 09 Sep 2020 21:16:50 GMT

Hi Sam,

Do you know if the teams are working on a new firmware version ? If tomorrow I deploy this in a warehouse I doubt that 32 mW is enough to ensure a good WIFI coverage. For me this is an important bug!

Do you have a feedback ? I can open a case it's really necessary.

Regards

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

SamPirok — Wed, 09 Sep 2020 21:44:03 GMT

We are always working on new firmware versions, but the more cases we have reporting a particular bug the more priority we can give to the bug fix. If you could open a case for this issue, that will help us raise the priority of a fix with engineering.

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

JonathanM — Wed, 16 Sep 2020 20:54:14 GMT

Hi Sam, we are facing the same issues using AP310i together with XCC version 5.06.03.

Have already two cases open in GTAC (#02207722 and #02247191)

Maybe this will help you for further investigation!

Best regards, Jonathan

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

SamPirok — Wed, 16 Sep 2020 20:59:15 GMT

Thanks very much Jonathan, that does help!

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

tcheurby — Wed, 16 Sep 2020 21:36:05 GMT

Hi sam,

I have opened a case at the GTAC with no answer since Friday, September 11th . My access points are well covered by a support contract… Case Number: 02242570

I don't see any trace of this bug in the new version 7.4.1.2-003R? is it fixed?

Thank you

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

SamPirok — Wed, 16 Sep 2020 21:42:15 GMT

Thank you for letting me know, and for providing your case number. I will reach out to the team that is managing your case to see what we can do to move the case forward. I haven’t heard of a fix yet, but that is something we’ll want to confirm via your case to be sure.

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

tcheurby — Thu, 17 Sep 2020 19:51:44 GMT

Hello,

Thanks to Marek from GTAC support for the explanations.

I must admit it is not too intuitive and it is confusing. Let me explain whole math behind.
The visible number in a CLI (i.e. show wireless radio) is a value before adding antenna gain, chain gain and possible MIMO gain. So basically a value leaving a chipset. All those things together (final radio transmition power) then cannot exceed maximum allowed power per regulations (20dBm).

So correct math in this case is like this:

12dBm visible output + 3dBm chain gain (radio is by default 2x2, so gain is 3dBm) + 5dBm antenna gain = 20dBm per maximum allowed by regulations. Meaning you cannot get over 12dBm visible output in 'show wireless radio', when using 2x2.

Regulatory table for AP310i is showing max 15dBm, which is a value for 1x1 radio. In case of using 2x2 (two chains used by default) are both radios using 12dBm per chain power and the final power is 15dBm. It is a reason, why regulatory table is showing 15 and why you see in CLI 12.

There was also the explanation in the last powerhour available on the dojo :

show wireless regulatory device-type APxxx country-id” command

For the legacy APs

This command basically showing the information of the legacy CFT table (Channel Frequency Table). The CFT table doesn’t have the information of “tx-chain numbers”, “antenna-type”, “antenna-gain” information, it only has the max EIRP power for each country/channel/placement/TPC combination.

For Extreme APs

The WiFi 6 APs (3xx/4xx/5xx) don’t use the legacy CFT table anymore, so the power/channel information is derived from the “Extreme Regulatory power table” which clearly defined the power values for each country/antenna-type/antenna-gain/channel/placement combination.

If the AP is an external antenna SKU, user will also need to give the antenna-type at the end of the command, eg “show wireless regulatory device-type AP3xx us ml-2452-apa2-01”

EIRP CALCULATION = TX Power + Antenna Gain + MIMO (Gain)

MIMO GAIN = 10*log(#of chains)

Regards,

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

JonathanM — Fri, 18 Sep 2020 22:30:35 GMT

ok, thanks for the explanation!

Nevertheless we measured the signal strength of the AP310i and also of AP3705/AP3935 in an installed base. With the AP310i we have around 10dB less signal at the same place.

But we discussing the issues at the moment with the GTAC so will see what they can find out!

Regards,

Re: Power AP310 WING 7.4.1.1-001R

tcheurby — Tue, 22 Sep 2020 19:43:39 GMT

Hi Jonathan,

Thank you for the information, it is indeed very worrying. I haven't yet done a real test with an Ekahau for example.
If you ever install this in a warehouse it can be very problematic I guess…

I don't know where we're going but I'm worried. AP WIFI 6 has been on the market for a long time now and there are still a lot of surprises to be discovered... And all the old APs are very soon EOS and it seems to me that it is difficult to get some of them

If tomorrow I get an order for 50 AP for a warehouse I would be very annoyed... It's nice CloudIQ but if the signal doesn't reach the picker the pallet won't leave. Sometimes it seems that Extreme doesn't realize the impact on a production and the cost with such a bug.

If you have news from the GTAC, I'm very interested 🙂

Regards,